In life, we're going to be in pain no matter what choices we make. Marcus Aurelius, second-century Emperor, Roman Emperor and Stoic philosopher, said, "Pain is neither unbearable nor unending, as long as you keep in mind its limits and don't magnify them in your imagination." He also said, "If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself, but to your estimate of it. And this you have the power to revoke at any moment."

Welcome to The Meaningful Sh!t Show, with your host Vincent. In a world full of selfishness, blaming, and scapegoating, Vincent aims to inspire inner work with deep topics and insights on emotion regulation, personal development, psychology, philosophy, and the trauma growth healing process. Welcome to another episode of the Meaningful [bleep] Show. I'm your host, Vincent. Today we're going to talk about pain.

I already gave you two quotes from Marcus Aurelius, and these quotes really revolve around pain and how we relate to it. He already highlights that pain is something that is unavoidable, but it's also not unbearable or unending, so we have power over it with our mind, in the sense of how we relate to it. Like I said, he was a second-century Roman Emperor, so this is wisdom, knowledge that's pretty old, and it goes even further back. It goes back to Buddhism, probably before that. But Buddhism has Four Noble Truths. The first is the truth of suffering, the second is the truth of the cause of suffering, the truth of the end of suffering, and the truth of the path that leads to the end of suffering.

Well, that is a mouthful, and we're not going to go into much of it, or all of it, but I do want to highlight the first Noble Truth, and that is the truth of suffering. The truth of suffering acknowledges that suffering is an inevitable part of life, and that having a body means experiencing illness, death, and displeasure. In other words, pain. It's something that comes with the territory.

What Buddhism also states is that the cause of suffering is desire or craving, and we can end this suffering, this sensation of desire or craving, striving towards certain things. But that's not where I want to take you today. I just want to really make a distinction between pain and suffering, because depending on the language that we're talking about, background, whatever, it actually gets kind of intermixed with each other, pain and suffering. But what is the difference?

Pain is a natural, physical or emotional sensation in a moment. It's your body or mind signaling that something is wrong or challenging. Whereas suffering is the mental or emotional response to that pain. So pain comes first, suffering comes second. It's how we interpret or amplify discomfort when we resist, dwell on, or fear it. So, pretty important, and this coincides with the second quote from Marcus Aurelius that I gave you. It's like we have the power to discontinue suffering whenever we want to, by stopping the resisting, dwelling on, fearing it, which again is very similar to what Buddhism teaches us: that the moment we stop craving or desire... because what is craving or desire? Of course you crave not pain, you desire pleasure. Pleasure and pain, of course, are connected. They're on a continuum. So all these teachings kind of point in the same direction, and I want to take that into the 21st century and look at what that means in present-day society, or at least how I've come to interpret it and how it's helped my life.

So I'm not arguing today to end all suffering. It's a very interesting topic to look at what Buddhism teaches us, the cessation of desire and craving, a super noble path. But today I want to keep us rooted in the world of desire and craving, where, in the Western world, most of us, most of us normies, if we're not a monk, right, nothing wrong with being a monk, if that's your path, go for it, but right now I'm relating to it from the relative world. Buddhism teaches us that when we do that, that we accept suffering into our heart, because we're striving for things, we're trying to avoid pain, it comes with the territory. So I don't really want to [bleep] with suffering directly, but what I do propose is that my way of framing pain, relating to pain, and choosing pain should reduce suffering.

Of course, this is an anecdotal experience by me, of course. There's things about this, but ultimately it's an experiment for you, if it works for you. This is true of basically everything that I talk about, all topics, self-help. You can have probability and science, or religion, or teachings, or something like that on your side, but you're still a unique individual creature, and you have to experiment. Open-minded experiment. Might not work for you, might work for you.

Getting back to the main topic. So pain is not avoidable, it's part of maintaining a body, and maintaining a body is, in a way, not aligning with the forces of nature, because the universe is constantly trying to break it apart. Entropy. Things don't stick together by itself. This is one of the core tenets of Buddhism: the only constant thing is change. The world is constantly falling apart from our perspective of trying to maintain this cohesion, this homeostasis of these cells we have, and these billions of bacteria that live, that create really the entire organism that we are.

I forget what the number is, but I think we have 1.3 times the amount of bacteria than we have cells in our body, and that of course includes the bacteria living in your digestive tract. So we're an ecosystem by ourselves. But what we can easily see is that it takes a lot of work to maintain this present form that we have, although even this present form is continuously changing. Cells are replenishing themselves, we have to constantly feed ourselves, and if that wasn't enough, we're also warm-blooded, so we have to maintain that temperature. Very, very energy-intensive, very maintenance-intensive, just to maintain that body. And someone's got to do it, and that's you. You haven't chosen, at least I don't remember choosing it, but yet we get that responsibility, we get that experience.

So you're not going to avoid pain, because pain is an important flag, it's an important signal. It can be emotional pain, it can be physical pain, physical pain of getting burned by a hot stove, but it can also be emotional pain, of, for example, shame or embarrassment or something like that, because we're social creatures and we like to stay part of society. We don't like to be sent off into the woods by ourselves, because we will not survive. That's not how humanity survives. We survive in packs.

So what I propose for this episode is very straightforward. First of all, I want you to visualize, and realize, and even radically accept that you will always face pain. Although you probably see in yourself these tendencies to avoid pain, to try to minimize pain, realize that ultimately you can only do that for small moments, right? You can't do that constantly. You're also, luckily, not constantly in pain. There are moments of rest. A bit like in my polyvagal theory episode, I talked about the fight-or-flight system versus the rest-and-digest system. I argued, go back to that episode if this sounds interesting to you, that we have to plan to go into fight-or-flight ourselves, versus staying in rest-and-digest, and the better we become at switching, like a sine wave, between these states, the more effective our life is going to be, more successful.

So instead of lingering in rest-and-digest too long, so that then the fight-or-flight is even more complicated, or we do long-term damage to ourselves, it's very useful to have in the back of your head that ultimately we're a biological creature, we are built to flip between these two states. We can't be in one the entire time. Fight-or-flight, we do need that rest, but we can't be resting all the time. Our body is not in the state that it absorbs a lot when it's like that. So when it's repaired, when it's ready, we've got to move. The more that we control that, the more that we choose that, the more that we plan for that, the more we control what we face, instead of just rolling into the next problem.

This is, of course, not a perfect science, in that there are unexpected things that will happen to us all the time. We might get into a fight-or-flight situation, or even a freeze situation, that is not planned. And even if we plan the rest-or-flight, fight-or-flight, perfectly, there are still unplanned, unexpected situations that arise. But we can control a large slice.

What I want to do is compare a couple of different types of pain, to highlight the difference in what I mean by choosing. So when I talk about choosing, choosing to go into fight-and-flight, choosing to seek out pain, to a certain extent, what I'm really talking about is taking control. Like I mentioned before, same with the fight-or-flight, it doesn't mean if I choose this specific pain over here, that doesn't mean that I am guaranteed that I'm not going to experience a different pain over here. Like, for example, if I accept the pain of working out, being uncomfortable, sweating, etc., I can still experience the emotional pain of someone breaking up with me. It doesn't mean if I take care of my body, I work out, that doesn't mean that something else won't go wrong in my life. But I'm going to compare pains that are connected to each other.

So if I choose the pain of getting out of my comfort zone, can be emotionally, can be physically, can be developmentally, compare that to the pain of regret of not doing that. If you choose to get out of your comfort zone, you get, as an ancillary additional benefit, not the pain of regret. Now it's up to you individually how you rate these two, right? We all have a certain appetite for being out of our comfort zone versus regret. Not everyone has the same loss aversion, as I like to call it. Version is mainly, I know it from the book Thinking, Fast and Slow, from Daniel Kahneman, where he highlights how we get used to gains, that's relatively, doesn't really give us that much dopamine, but depending on the type of person you are, that's the loss aversion. You can respond very adversely to losing, experiencing a loss, or your loss aversion can be, you know, you can have a higher loss aversion than the average bear. But still, it's a continuum.

On the other side of the pain of being out of your comfort zone, there's also the pain of the consequences of not saying no. The comfort zone here being saying no to someone, that is uncomfortable, that is painful, but the consequences are also painful. We need awareness, we need mindfulness, to realize that, and realize that we're making a choice. We're not choosing the hard thing up front, we're getting the second thing.

How about comparing this pain of not getting out of our comfort zone with the pain of distracting with substances? So we might not get out of our comfort zone, and that might come with us distracting ourselves with substances. It's a way to pass the time, because if you would not be distracting yourself with substances, or with porn, or something like that, something that is within your comfort zone, drinking might be in your comfort zone, masturbating to porn might be within your comfort zone, it's not really, classically, there's not a lot of investment there. You get a bunch of dopamine for it, with a consequence. So maybe initially, when I give you these two options, hey, do you want to get drunk, or do you want to get out of your comfort zone, you might be like, oh, let me get drunk, that's much more fun, that's much easier. That's true, initially. It is important to design something on the other side of being out of your comfort zone, that is worth it, that is worth saying no to some of these easy sources of dopamine.

I've used the quote of Jordan Peterson before, a quote that I really like, I'm going to slightly butcher it, but it's from an interview with him, where he says that alcohol is fun, and in order to not drink too much, you have to make sure that you have something on the other side, an adventure. He says something like, you need an adventure, man, or, if truth be told, alcohol is the substitute for the adventure to begin with. So really, what you do is you distract with substances because you're not getting out of your comfort zone, you're not having a great life. So then you're just going for something that's relatively dull, it's not really going to do that much for you. So this is another way of looking at these two types of pain, the consequences. There is not necessarily a pain of distracting with, but getting drunk by itself is not painful, the consequences of what that means, they are painful in the longer term. Again, it's good to think about, good to compare these two with each other.

A little bit of a callback to a previous episode: how about the pain of setting boundaries with others? That's work. You have to reflect on what your boundaries are, you have to enforce those boundaries, if someone crosses the boundary you have to enact some kind of behavioral change, some kind of deal that you made with yourself, maybe you didn't even tell that person, but you told yourself. That's an introspective process that requires knowing your own values. That's work, it's painful. But what about the pain of being walked on, or feeling resentful? That's also a type of emotional pain you choose.

What about the pain of failing at something new? Feels horrible, doesn't it? Very similar to getting out of your comfort zone, honestly. What if we compare that with the pain of never trying and always wondering, what if? Honestly, it's the same pain as the one that I mentioned before about the comfort zone, just formulated in a slightly different way, right? Because always wondering what if, of course, is regret.

What about the pain of letting go of toxic relationships? That is short-term pretty hard. Compare that with the pain of staying in them and losing yourself, that's a longer-term effect. Short-term, it's much easier to stay in the toxic relationship, oftentimes, and this is a trend that you will see, is that there's an upfront pain and a delayed pain. Of course, we generally go for instant gratification and not instant pain. Reflect on that, why that is, or rather, I mean, it's not rocket science why that is, that way. One is pleasurable, the other is not. But more, what the consequences of that are, what that means.

How about the pain of sitting through meditation or silence? Maybe that's not a great pain, might just be uncomfortable, versus the pain of a restless, noisy mind. Again, upfront, do you eat the toad right away, eat the frog, what is the expression again, or do you kind of not do it and deal with the consequences? Because you're going to get through the day whether or not you meditate, in the beginning of the day and have a calm mind, versus dealing with that restless, noisy mind. I mean, you've done it the rest of your life, right, you'll get there.

It's interesting, one of my favorite ones, I talk a lot about working out, I'm a very athletically active person, I spend a lot of my time and resources working on that, I find it very meaningful in my life to challenge my body, to learn new things, grow in certain ways, whether it's cardio, weightlifting, whatever. So we have the pain of a sore body after a workout, or tired legs, or just tired in general, right? You might be tired and you want to go to sleep sooner, that's very possible, and in fact that's good to do, because the next day your body will be less sore, sleep is very important. But compare that with the pain of being out of shape, the pain of a sore back sitting on the couch all day. Your pain is going to be presented to you.

And when I mentioned the pain of a sore body, I didn't even mention the pain of the workout itself, partially, I think, because a workout is not painful to me. I very much enjoy it, it's a pleasurable activity to me, which is also a consequence of years and years of working at it and making it really part of my identity, I guess, so that it's not something that I don't want to do. When it's time to go to the gym, I want to, or run, or whatever it is. So compare the pain of, maybe I should call it the pain of vigorous exercise, right, getting your heart rate above, whatever it is for your specific age, but let's say 125, 130, or something like that, for 75 minutes a week. You can also not do that, and deal with the pain of being groggy, of doing nothing all day. If you don't work out, if you don't do that stuff, you're still going to get through the days, but it's not going to be good for your energy, in a way. It's a vicious circle, and again, of course, the pain of regret. How many times have we heard about that, have we experienced that for ourselves, that we wanted to do a thing, we told ourselves we were going to do the thing, and then we don't do that, we don't take the pain up front, and we get the bill afterwards. Guess what? Interest on that bill.

How about the pain of dealing with craving and not giving into, let's say, a bored mouth? I forget from which language this is, but a friend of mine told me about that, you're not hungry, you have a bored mouth, right? That's an emotional pain, especially craving. Craving and desire, I've talked about that in my episode about addiction, there's lots to be said about craving and desire, there's something to master there, there's something to master, the fact that you are actually engaging with craving, you're increasing it yourself, and this requires mindfulness, this requires the skill of urge surfing, if you're interested in that, watch that episode about addiction. But this pain of dealing with your cravings, sort of like doing the right thing, comes to nutrition every day, because it doesn't let up. You don't have to do that one day, no, you have to do it every day. You don't have to be right 100% of the time, we have to be right 80% of the time. Compare that with the pain of being overweight, low self-esteem, the pain of getting sick, pain of getting cancer or diabetes, the pain of just not being able to move as a regular person, again also pain, pain after the fact, pain that you can't avoid, pain that just gets presented to you. Where the other pain, pain of going to the gym, you choose, maybe the pain of the sore body you don't choose in exactly the same way, it's just a consequence of going to the gym, or it can, of course, also work out in a way that your body is not, but you get the point.

I think I spoke about sleeping, so let's take a look at the pain of missing out on partying, socializing, watching new shows and whatever. Are you sometimes in the situation that you know you should sleep, because sleep is super essential, super, super important for your quality of life in the moment, for your longevity, for the health of your body, etc., but then there's moments that you just want to go partying, you want to go socializing, you want to keep bingeing that TV show, because your friends or your family are talking about it, right? If you don't do that, that's a pain, that's painful, that's emotional discomfort, doesn't feel good, you probably feel it a bit in your stomach, right? But if we don't face that pain, we don't step to the plate, what are we facing? We're facing the pain of non-accomplishment, being average, or most terrible of all, I think, being unauthentic, right? Are these things, partying, socializing, new shows, are we doing that because it's expected of us, are we being authentic, is that growing into our most self-actualized version? I don't think so.

How about the pain versus the pain of being sleep-deprived? You engage in that, the next day doesn't start right, because you didn't go to bed at the time that you wanted to. Different type of pain, you sent the bill to future you. How about the pain of having to be disciplined, be the adult in the room? Similar to some of the pains that I've talked about before, you offset that with the pain on the other side of being mediocre, unauthentic, and not actualized. It comes with the territory, there's no other way to do this. And of course, we all, I do realize that we have different ways of looking at life, but the way that I look at life is being disciplined, being intentional, having values, acting, to a certain extent being a square, right, because going to bed early, whatever, it's for squares, right. But if you're not those things, you do deal with the pain of being more mediocre, unauthentic, and not actualized, is the comparison that I have here.

Now, it's of course not always true, you can easily, if you logically peel that apart, there's different ways of approaching this, of course your values can be quite different, maybe it's very important for you to be in tune with your intuition, and if your intuition says, I have to stay up all night and do this thing, and maybe it's not watching Netflix, it's researching something like that, or socializing, or something like that, you might not face a pain of being mediocre or unauthentic. So I would challenge you to not try too much to see how some of these points that I'm making are wrong or irrational, that there's problems with them, holes that you can poke in them, sure you can, but try to see how it applies to you. Steel-man it, don't strawman it, it's easy to strawman things.

So another one, and that is, do you know about owner versus victim-based thinking? That mentality where, for an owner, things arise in life and they take ownership for them, they accept that they have created a life in which these things are possible to happen, that is their choice. That can be quite extreme. If you get hit by a bus, ultimately you can say, that's it, I'm a victim, there's nothing that I could have done about that. Of course there is, of course you could not be in the street, you could stay in your apartment all of your life, get groceries delivered, whatever, there are ways to not be in the street, there's also ways of being a lot more careful, whatever, right. So although you might encounter a negative event that you don't like, but if you take ownership for it, you realize that you've created this set of circumstances, and the rest of the set of circumstances, you wanted, it is much easier to accept a negative consequence of that, because things tend to not be completely all positive on the whole, right. Whereas a victim always looks for someone to blame.

Do you know these people that haven't really achieved that much in life, and when you talk to them, it's always someone's fault, it's the government, it's the aliens, it's the lizard people, it's the blood-drinking reptiles, or maybe they're not super into conspiracy theory land, but you probably get a feeling of the type that I mean. Generally these people are very self-righteous but ineffective, and that is because of that victim thinking. Realize, with both of these types of thinking, you accept a pain. A pain of being an owner is dealing with that emotional discomfort of, damn it, I created this for myself, the pain of trying to find the perspective of, this is happening for me, not to me, I created this in some kind of grand scheme. That's painful, that requires emotional work. It's much easier to just blame something, oh, this is the fault of the dumb people, or smart people, or the left, or the right, or whatever it is. See that you also accept a pain when you're a victim, and the pain that you're accepting is not being effective. Victim-based thinking is not effective, you can look that up, see how mental health thinks about that. But what is effective is a belief in a mindset of self-efficacy, that you influence results. If you're a victim of everything, why would you try to do things? It makes no point, it makes no sense to do so. Two different pains, you choose.

How about this one, the pain of vulnerability and love versus the pain of loneliness and isolation? This is an interesting thing for me personally, because I really feel this spectrum, this continuum. I can feel that there is a pain of being vulnerable in that way, it's emotional labor, it is risky. It is a lot less risky to be isolated and alone, in the sense of you control everything. Then statistics show us that people that spend too much time alone, not by choice, it's not the thing that they would prefer, to be in community, but they are not, it's terrible for your life expectancy. So there's a choice there, there's a continuum, two different types of pain. In this case, for me personally, it's a little bit less that there is a very preferable one, like for me this shows me how my thinking is maybe a little skewed at this point in life, I don't know about that. Pain of vulnerability and love, I find that complicated, but I've also felt the pain of loneliness and isolation. So that's another continuum, it's an interesting one to take a look at.

How about the pain of being honest with others versus the pain of living a life of pretense? Now, the one does not, the other applies, right, you can be dishonest with others and still live a life of pretense, and you can be honest with others and live a life of pretense, but you probably agree with me that there is some kind of causal connection between the two. Emotionally, you probably feel like it can be, again, just like the vulnerability and love, it can be very painful, emotionally painful, to be honest, to be honest in the right way, in a compassionate way. But a life of pretense, where you're inauthentic, this is another inauthentic one, that of course is, you're going to get presented with a bill much later, and it's going to be much higher, it's going to be a lot of interest on that bill.

Another one, how about the pain of choosing your stress and the pain of stress finding you anyway? I merely replace the word pain with stress, it's the exact same comparison, but stress is something that we all encounter in life, so it's another particular manifestation of pain that is good to focus on. Can you see that if you choose stress, that that might mean that you forgo other types of stress? For example, if you choose the stress of a full-time job, you forgo the stress of being financially insecure, right? So again, it's choosing your stress, again similar to choosing your pain, but it can be really good to look at it that way, where, can I choose something that is painful, stressful, and what does that net me, just selfishly, in this world of survival, you have choices there. You can also choose stress that nets you nothing, this is the type of stress that will leave you feeling resentful, maybe the stress of constantly taking care of people that should be taking care of themselves, right, there are situations, people that constantly stick their neck out for people and don't get anything back. But there's stress that you can choose that is growth-oriented, that does something for you, and again, remember, stress is going to find you anyway, so you might as well choose the best one, instead of waiting around and then dealing with the stress, and that might not be a growth-oriented stress.

Talked about finances before, how about the pain of budgeting and limited spending, oh my God, such a square, so boring, versus the pain of financial insecurity and debt? I have many feelings about this one, I think I've talked about this before in other episodes. I'm very budget-minded, and not as much limited spending, actually. What budgeting did for me is actually increased my spending, because my default is more to be a penny-pincher, and when I create a budget, it's a little bit like spending someone else's money, at least that's how I feel, in the sense of, if I allocated something to, let's say, groceries, it doesn't feel like I have to be like, oh, if I now spend this extra $10 on this luxury product that I want, that means I can't go to the movies, or something. No, both of these things have been allocated, right. So that's the way that I trick myself into thinking about, what are my priorities, assigning dollars to these priorities, and spending what I think I should be spending, and not feel guilty about that. It's how it works for me. Lots of people, they just experience it as limiting their spending, they can't be as in the moment, they can't be as intuitive, and some people can be intuitive with money, and it's fine, but on the other side is the financial insecurity and debt that often happens, even the people that I've known that say that they have a great intuition about that, I do see them ending up getting in debt. Now that doesn't mean that they're doing anything wrong, and it doesn't necessarily mean that I'm right, it just means that we're in different financial situations. But anyway, to bring it back to what I'm really talking about, is you can see the continuum here between budgeting and limited spending versus financial security and debt, both for both of them there's pain involved. Pain of budgeting is more around being boring and square, and like having to not procrastinate, and limited spending does maybe feel prohibitive, but you can see the freedom that you would get to not deal with the pain of the financial insecurity and debt.

Let's get a little bit more esoteric. How about the pain of confronting mortality and meaninglessness? Watch my episode about nihilism, absurdism, and existentialism. That's painful, it's painful to deal with the fact that you have a brain that can predict that you're going to die. It can be hard to realize that there is no absolute meaning in the universe, at least when I went looking, I discovered that through nihilism. There is no God-given meaning that is out there in the universe, first you have to create that for yourself. Now, if you ascribe to a religion, and you believe that the meaning is created by a god, realize that you're still choosing that, you're choosing to take on the authority of your religious scripture and find meaning in that, but in a way, the meaning is not in there, you ascribe a meaning to it, you are a meaning generator, you're the authority. But that's painful, it's painful to realize that, and it can get you really in a funk when you do that for the first time.

But what do we have on the other side? We have the pain of living in denial and never reflecting deeply, just living blindly, just being in an egoic roller coaster of society, going through these things, you know, eating, sleeping, [bleep], [bleep], that's it, and for some people that's enough, just engage with the pleasures of life. But I think that there's lots of regret associated with that. So that's one that has a special significance to me, although I don't really like the pain of dealing with the meaninglessness, it's uncomfortable.

There's also pain in being a good parent, properly raising your child, setting out the rules, sticking to the rules, but on the other side, of course, you have the pain of raising a spoiled, entitled kid, that is not suitable to really thrive in society, although you can't fully ever control that as a parent, right, there's lots of variability there, but it's also a continuum, it's painful to engage with actually being present with your child.

To close out, and you probably already get the picture, but really what I've been repeating over and over is that we have a choice between the pain of facing and choosing pain, versus the pain of ignoring and avoiding pain and getting pain anyway. That's really the bind that we are in. I think that there's an existential truth in that we kind of have to choose one or the other, go to pain with our eyes open, or pain is just going to bite us in the ass. It's your choice. One is an owner choice, one is a victim choice, you can see the difference in effectiveness in both, so that's really what it comes down to.

My message ultimately to you is: choose your pain. Plan for your pain. Make a routine that has your chosen pain built in. Don't be afraid of pain, don't think of pain too negatively. Whenever you feel that sneaky feeling of your ego, or you, or however you want to phrase that, wanting to weasel out, trying to weasel out of the pain, taking a shortcut, remind yourself of this principle, that the chosen pain is always the better pain. It's going to pay you dividends over the long term, it's going to make for a more meaningful, actualized life, where you are the owner instead of the victim, instead of just blowing in the wind, going in the direction of whatever thing fate hands to you.

So I would also say that you need awareness and reflection to spot some of those patterns, because a lot of these points that I made seem obvious, you know, I could have shot a 35-second short on this as well, in fact we tried to do that, but in a way the essence is very obvious, it's not rocket science. Why did we spend so much time talking about it, why did we spend so much time looking at all these different permutations of it, all these different incarnations of it? Because it's sneaky, because we have blind spots. I hope by giving you a lot of these examples, for some of these examples you're like, oh yeah, duh, I already do that, or I don't want to do that, or whatever, but for some of these, that reaction is, oh, huh, I didn't even realize that there were these two pains in this continuum, I didn't even know that I was making that choice, oh, is that what's going on. So that's what I hope that the examples have done for you.

All right, that's it for today. I thank you for tuning in. I was your host, Vincent, and I'm looking forward to seeing you next time on The Meaningful [bleep] Show.

Have a great day.